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Massey Discussion Forums :: Massey Talk :: Massey Harris General Purpose Four Wheel Drive View modes: 
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Posted: 3/26/2013 4:48:45 AM
   

RE:Massey Harris General Purpose Four Wheel Drive

Joe, Drew, Gary, JB,

Not sure what all the fuss is about really.  It was simply a coincidental demonstration of the versatility, power, climbing ability and traction of an industrial GP.

There was no petrol in the tank and I wanted to move it in the shed.  So I hitched my MF 165 to it with a steel pole and started to pull it along backwards.  By misfortune I had left it in gear and it fired up running on what petrol was left in the carburettor.  It was so strong that the 165 wouldn't hold it and I got slowly pushed along.  It veered off to one side and climbed up the wheel of the 12-20 at which point the petrol in the carburettor ran out.  Hardly any damage to either - the GP wheel just caught the 12-20 radiator shroud and bonnet a bit but only 10 minutes or so to straighetn them out.

All in all a very enlightening and eductational experience which I had the privelege of witnessing from high up on the 165.  I was astonished at its pushing and climbing power.  But there again these industrials are weighted down with cast center wheels which must weigh at least 600 lbs each.  This particular tractor is a superb starter so that was proven too.

A unique and pleasurable - and lucky! - experience.  It is the only GP industrial known to have performed such a feat.  I can see why they were used on shunting tasks.

I bought this GP from Ken Reichert's sale in Ontario a few years ago.  It had had a distinguished history at the Tornto Maple Leaf Ice Hockey club where it was sold new to in 1933 by Purc McMaster (of book fame) and who only died a very few years ago at over 100 years old.  It is one of only two known surviving industrial GPs with a 50 inch tread.  It is different to the agricultural GPs in that it was only ever sold on rubbers and the tread is measured on these.  On agricultural tractors the tread ratings are always on steel wheels and do not apply if rubber wheels are fitted - they are then wider.
However beware some agriculturals have been fitted with these cast center wheels and are often considered to be industrials.  They are not - always look at the serial number plate for the track width designation.  Also the industrials have front hitch points for snow ploughs etc which are not present on agriculturals.

John


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User avatar
Posted: 3/26/2013 5:43:47 AM
   

RE:Massey Harris General Purpose Four Wheel Drive

Joe,

Do you or anyone else know if the OHV GPs were also offerd as industrials like the Side valves.  I have never seen any brochure evidence for this - only for the side valves.

John

John


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User avatar
Posted: 3/26/2013 9:34:14 AM
   

RE:Massey Harris General Purpose Four Wheel Drive

John:

Yes they were offered in the Industrial version with the OHV GP. Here is a picture of Parts list number 32-A  with just some of the parts listed for the OHV Industrial Notice the 35-15/16" Centers verses the 43-15/16" Centers.... Also here is a picture of an OHV Industrial  Serail # 303035 notice the width is not stamped but it is an Industrial.

Joe

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GPPartsNumber32-A.jpgIndustrialPartsList.jpgIMG_0331.jpgIMG_0317.jpg366.jpg

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User avatar
Posted: 3/26/2013 9:45:49 AM
   

RE:Massey Harris General Purpose Four Wheel Drive

Joe,

What exact measurement do you think they are referring to when they say "centres"?

Have you seen the front hosuings  for snow ploghs etc on that tractor? Like on mine.

John


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User avatar
Posted: 3/26/2013 11:34:39 AM
   

RE:Massey Harris General Purpose Four Wheel Drive

John:

I believe what they mean by Centers is the meaurement from the center of the left Ball Joint to the Center of the right Ball joint. It appears that the part # RO2228C is refering to the Steering drag link " Large Tie Rod  pipe between wheels holding Steering Ball joints". here is a picture from the book.

When I took these picture sometime back I really did not know what to look for so did not get a pictue from the front of the drop housing but did get one from the back. By looking at the pictue from the back it does not appear to have the extra piece cast into it like yours but I am just wondering if yours is a special piece made just for a front plow???  I do know this is an Industrial as you can't get it any narrower than this as the drop housing piece is only about 3/4 inch away from the transmition case.

I went back on here and added the picture of my housing so you can see them side by side to see the difference.

Joe

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GPSteeringArm.jpg371.jpgIMG_6059.jpg

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User avatar
Posted: 3/26/2013 12:19:56 PM
   

RE:Massey Harris General Purpose Four Wheel Drive

John:

Just went out and measured my 48 inch GP. It is hard to get a good measurement trying to get the tape strung through the back of the engine and hooked near the center of the other ball joint and run a camera at the same time but here it is. Yours should be at 35 & 15/16 as my tractor is just what it said 43 & 15/16.

The second picture shows just how much wider my housing is than the Industrial and the 3rd picture shows just how much wider the housing is on a 76 inch tractor wich is the widest of them all.

Joe

Post attachments:
IMG_6056.jpgIMG_6058.jpgIMG_6060.jpg

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User avatar
Posted: 3/26/2013 1:14:47 PM
   

RE:Massey Harris General Purpose Four Wheel Drive

Thanks for that Joe - it all makes sense.

As for the "attachment points for a plough or bracket" - call them what you will - on mine these are part of the main wheel gear housing casting and not bolt ons.  It begs the question what exactly is this tractor you have found?  It undoubtedly has the very narrow axle arrangement of an industrial but what has happened to its "industrial" cast wheels?  I can't get in the sheds at the moment to take a photo because of massive frozen snow drifts against the doors.

By chance I am doing an article on the GPs for one of our magazines at the moment and was pulling all facts and figures together.  I was reminded that the industrials had considerably higher gearing so I think you need to get that tractor, get it running and give it a spin.  Top speed for an industrial is supposed to be 9 mph.  Never given mine a burn out!!

John


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User avatar
Posted: 3/26/2013 1:53:46 PM
   

RE:Massey Harris General Purpose Four Wheel Drive

John:

Wich magazine is the article going to be in? Is it one I can get here at Tractor Supply? If so I will have to keep an eye out for it as I can never get too  much information on the GPs.

Joe


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User avatar
Posted: 3/27/2013 5:56:30 AM
   

RE:Massey Harris General Purpose Four Wheel Drive

Joe,

It is for the Ferguson Heritage magazine.  Copies only go to club members but Steve M is a member so maybe you can copy his. Likely to be in the Ocober issue - only three isues a year.

I'm simply trying to pull the facts about the GPs together in a straight line for possibly the first time?

Will photograph that industrial bracket arrangment as soon as I can get in the shed.

Something nagging me that the tractor you have shown is something of a hybrid - definitely an industrial axle set up but wheels odd, where's the industrial wheels and the bracket arrangment.  Maybe a spare industrial chassis sold off as an agricultural?  Have you checked the front track width - is it industrial width too?

John
John


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User avatar
Posted: 3/27/2013 6:43:58 AM
   

RE:Massey Harris General Purpose Four Wheel Drive

Another very interesting and informative M-H thread developing here.

In respect of your first post Joe and the GP pictured at our Carrington Rally in 2011 with one of Robert Crawford's service vans in the picture, this tractor is not one from his collection, it is owned by a collector in Norfolk, I can confirm it is an owner creation, everything forward of the bell housing was missing and he put in the six cylinder engine, together with making up the radiator and bands between the spade lugs on the wheels, they are not original M-H equipment, but expect they work well and act as a directional skid ring in the field as well as a road band to keep the lugs off a road surface. The owner at the time of this retoration had a large contracting business and found his stone crushing machines used "twin disc" slip clutches from the USA, he contacted the company and they sent him a clutch to fit this GP, I was amazed to hear Twin Disc are still in business manufacturing clutches.


Malcolm.



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