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challenger engine

I am working on an unstyled challenger and after pulling the head off to see why the compression seeemed low,  I saw that the liners had seen there better days (about what I had expected to find for a $200 tractor).It does start and run, but to do it right I would like to replace the liners.  They are badly worn and very pitted from the outside. I was looking at getting a set cusom made. I was wondering if anyone has done this, or is it cost effective?  am assuming a replacement set or new old stock would be non-existant.  Any thoughts would help. Thanks Todd S

RE:challenger engine

Todd,

Unless you are wanting to do a pristine restoration then why not sit back and be thankful that the the old girl starts and runs?   Grind/re-seat the valves in and you will probably see an improvement in the compression.  Ask yourself do you want to work the tractor or simply start it up occasionally and ride it round the yard?

Making liners from scratch would be expensive unless you have a friendly engineer.  NOS liners are certainly not hanging on the trees but you might just be lucky somewhere.  Joe P might be able to advise on  new liners still lavailable for another make of tractor that could be "trimmed down" to fit.  Joe advised me on a set for my GP and it wasn't a lot of work for my engineer to cut them down to the right length then make the necessarsy trimming to fit.

May you have a happy and succesful New Year!
John

RE:challenger engine

Melling Cylinder Sleeves in Iowa made one for my MH 25 a few years ago. It seems like it was around $300 with freight. Not cheap, but I couldn't find one.
563-652-6807 Ext. 17

RE:challenger engine

Hi Todd,

I'm still in shock you got an unstyled challenger that runs for $200.... happy, happy days...

Like John said, provided it runs, higher compression only permits higher power so unless you need more power .... does it matter?

Out of curiosity what defects do the liners have? can you post a photo? 

I've just brought an unstyled Pacemaker back to life and I made an adapter for a compression gauge - I wanted to verify the compressions because some of my valves were seized and it took a fair while for them all to free off and even out. It would be interesting to hear how low they are...

Happy new year to you and all the MCA members out there....

Cheers, Jon.



RE:challenger engine

Thanks for the responses. One can never have enough opinions to toss around. My biggest issue with the liners is the deep pitting around the outside. I Know these are almost 1/4 inch thick but the pitting is really deep and I would hate to put all the time replacing rings and a valve job only to find a hole in a liner a few years down the road. The bore measures 3.887 . Should be 3.875.  I'm sure it would run ok with a new set of rings and a valve job, I have done that many times before. Depending what I find on this project I will probably do it again. I am planning on checking with some custom sleeve builders this week just to satisfy my couriosity, And I am going to check the demensions on the liner from a model c case, I don't think they are too far apart in size and you can still get them new. If I can could get them to fit with a minimal amount of machining that could be another option, Hope everyone has a happy new year and pleny of time to play with some old iron. Thanks, Todd S

RE:challenger engine

Congratulations on your latest purchase Todd, hope you can post some photo's on here.

Another option for your original liners is to bore them out in situ leaving a lip at the bottom, then press in a thin wall dry liner with a bore to match your piston and rings. The lip at the bottom and cylinder head gasket at the top holds the dry liner in place.
I did this on one of my 12-20's several years ago, a local engineer came with his boring machine, a mornings work and all four were installed, the biggest job was cleaning all the swarf out of the "u" frame after the in situ boring.

Malcolm.


RE:challenger engine

After a few phone calls and e-mails I have found that I can get a set of liners made for around $900 with shipping. About the time I found that out, I found a crack in the deck surface of the block between #3 and 4 cylinder. Luckily I have a parts tractor out back. Hopefully this block will work out a little better

RE:challenger engine

Todd,

That is a pretty good price on a set of sleeves especially if they will drop right in with no machining. As for switching the block this may be an easy fix but the numbers won't match the tractor then.

If this is just a crack like I am thinking it is I wouldn't get too excited about it. I had the same problem on my Cub jr when I put it back together. I didn't let it bother me much, just put a good dab of glue on it when installing the head gasket and have never had a problem with it. The engine is a non pressurized cooling system so not a big deal. I wouldn't be surprised if the engine you have for parts has the same crack. A lot of MH 55s and MH 555s have these cracks sometimes between all the cylinders as this is the weak spot.

Joe
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RE:challenger engine

Yes, that is the same crack I have. Youre right, what can it hurt on a non pressurized system. Maybe i'll give it a try. I do have all the sleeves out so I could give the block a good cleaning. My question is how to re seal them. Just get the correct size packing and squeeze it in? or dont't disturb the old packing and put it back together? any thoughts would help. Thanks